We don't hate the Assembly. Period.

A welcome mat (0.00 / 0)

or a club?

When you give people keys to the front page that call the Assembly Democrats critters, Denny Farrell a d#*&%*$bag, call for their removal, for races against them and rebuke them for selecting the State Comptroller that they wanted, (not one dictated to them by Spitzer). And then you take the Speaker they elected, (yes there is a vote), and equate him to the leader of Iraq, and openly call for his removal with help for any opponent to him because Phil lives just one subway stop away. Oh and to googlebomb them, well how can you blame the impression really.

You're saying please take comments lightly as we only find you half bad, you're actually not that bad on issues. Look, I know you're honestly trying to count but they are not 104. While I may appreciate, it to the next person it might show disregard for accomplishments for the ones you missed.  

Are your comments a little too little, and a day too late.  Let's just say by my count things are in motion no one can stop. Not everyone sees or experiences things the same. A post one may find humorous someone else may find hateful. But that's just my impression. Beware the power of the pen.

I for one prefer fighting Republicans who have destroyed our economy, our social programs and the environment just to name a few small items. And I will fight them because that's what I see as the true evil on this planet. When you look back over the past year you have to admit a lot of the criticism on the Albany Project is leveled at why Assembly Democrats are bad and why the leader they selected to lead them must go. I'm not sure saying we don't hate the Assembly period makes it all now simply go away. Again, just my humble opinion.

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by: TruBlu @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 11:44:30 AM UTC

It's not too late (0.00 / 0)

to begin a dialogue and to find common ground. I agree that the anti-Silver sentiment is unfair (OK, sometimes it borders on the hysterical), but there is a LOT of misinformation out there and Silver isn't the kind of guy who goes around whining that he's misunderstood. I'm hopeful that folks are open to looking at the Assembly in general, and Silver in particular, from a different perspective.

And that they will reserve their ammunition for our real enemies.

 

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by: justthinking @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 12:20:55 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

There will be no open dialogue regarding those who have the keys! (0.00 / 0)

You, TruBlu, are now the second commentor to mention that issue! I also prefer fighting Republicans, but this poster is overly sensitive and way too confrontational while always insisting on the last word for himself!

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by: politics64 @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 12:29:05 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

I'm glad your main issue... (0.00 / 0)

Is whether or not you have keys to the front page, politics64.

And your personal jab is noted.

Why don't you go to Daily Kos and complain about not getting keys to the front page. I would love to see it - for entertainment's sake.  

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by: robert.harding @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 14:32:39 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

You're missing the point... (0.00 / 0)

Again...

I'll put it into much simpler words for you: We should expect more out of Democrats. We are Democrats here and if some feel like members of our own party are letting them down, that is their right.

I, too, prefer fighting Republicans. But if our presidential nominating process is any proof, fighting amongst each other is alive and well.

I never said that my post would make it go away. But I would hope that it would straighten out some of the gut reactions of people who come to this blog. Just as you say that there are people who are here going extreme on the Assembly, there are people who come here and say that we have an "anti-Assembly sentiment", for example. Those are pretty strong words. But again, this is more about the culture in Albany than anything else. There is a reason this blog is called what it is.  

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by: robert.harding @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 14:23:31 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Expectations (4.00 / 2)

I get the main point, and it's a good one.  The Assembly is good, but could be better.  I know; I'd be there now were it not for car trouble...

Now, because we are Democrats, we expect more from our party.  By holding them to a higher standard, we make our party stronger.  2008 is a strong year for our party because we're doing things from the ground up.

That starts by making concerns known, and these blogs are one of the places that's happening.  I see them as the absolute best place for them to happen, as they are unfiltered.  Gut reactions, yes, and they'll be recorded so we not only get a glimpse of the people's opinions but also their evolving thought process.  Studying that is one of the keys to changing longstanding instutitutions like the Assembly.

If there's an issue that people feel strongly about, I think it's better they say what they would say at the kitchen table in a public forum than keep it between the peas and carrots.  It is speech at its most free.  That's how ideas spread; and we humans are emotional beings and our politics is still one of sensationalism.  

So there's bound to be disagreements of perception, like whether we are allegedly Anti-Assembly or just rabidly Pro-Reform here.  And it's all too easy to attribute the opinions of one member here to the entire community.

Add those two issues together, and a certain presidential candidate comes to mind.  One who is trying to change our politics of division and who is overcoming the accusations that the opinions of those around him are his, too.

So we shouldn't expect that we are in a group-think mode here, but we should expect to all be on the same page.  I think it's called the Albany Project because to have a sucessful project, you have to get people to work together.  So see the strong words on the issues as strong because we all care about the state of this state, not as an invitation for flame wars or arguments about who gets front-page treatment.  Any idea that gets out there will be seen, and has impact beyond what we can study.

Well said, robert: We are trying to change a culture of insider status in Albany.  So to be successful, we should not fall into a culture of in-ighting while we're at it.

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by: Soundpolitic @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 16:11:19 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

Some clarification (0.00 / 0)

1) you are right- my comment about Denny Farrell was wrong.  Although it is not an excuse, I was very frustrated of Ferrell's lack of effort at taking the Senate during his tenure.  But you are right, I shouldn't have said that

2) I didn't compare Shelly to the president of Iraq- I compared him to a member of Iraq's presidency council.  That post was tounge-in-cheek, but many people did not realize that.  I thought the fact that Iraq has codified the 3-men-in-a-room was deserving of aome sad, ironic humor.  That's all I meant about that.  

3) I prefer fighting republicans any day, and I would always choose Shelly Silver over Joe Bruno.  However, we have a responsibility to clean house in our own party as well

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by: Roatti @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 16:20:14 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

An open dialogue (0.00 / 0)

is important. I couldn't agree more.

I guess my fear has been that we might be circling our wagons and shooting inward instead of outward.

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by: justthinking @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 11:54:06 AM UTC

in a state where Democrats dominate (4.00 / 1)

we need to get over the fear that our current elected officials are the best we can do.

We need to take back the Senate, yes - but we also need to clean our own house.

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by: simonstl @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 11:57:04 AM UTC

[ Parent ]

In the Assembly (4.00 / 1)

Doing an inventory of ourselves and seeing what we can do better should be in order. Like I said, I can't disagree with everything Silver has done, but it is his leadership style and approach that I question.  

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by: robert.harding @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 14:29:08 PM UTC

[ Parent ]

We need a legislature (4.00 / 3)

but what we have is a Potemkin legislature that has all of the trappings and little of the functionality.

I don't think any Democrats here are surprised to see Republicans indulging in such behavior after the lunacy of the last eight years.

It definitely hurts, though, to watch Democrats indulging in it, which they unfortunately do quite spectacularly in the Assembly.

Magnifying the problem is that so much of the supposed conflict between the Democrat Assembly and Republican Senate is basically play-acting, window-dressing for an extremely stable system underneath.  

Legislators just hope that no one's noticed that the Assembly's given the Republicans the keys to the Senate by letting them redistrict it however they like, and the Senate's returned the favor.

We need to get these folks out of office, and we need to do it on our side as well as their side.  That means reviving the Democratic party so it's actually democratic - and that may take a generation or so.

New Yorkers need to criticize legislators, we need to target legislators, and we need to upset legislators - because New Yorkers need New York back.  As Democrats, I think we need to clean our own house too.  (And I wouldn't bet that taking the Senate will magically fix the Assembly, either.)

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by: simonstl @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 11:55:26 AM UTC

REFORM! (4.00 / 4)

As resident granny of the crowd, with much-loved relatives who are not only Republican, but some of whom even work for the Republican majority in the Senate:

All this talk of hate, and shooting, and confrontation is over the top to me, whether it applies to people who we disagree with on issues, or those we disagree with on tactics. Kinda still a peacenik from the sixties, I guess, Kumbaya (ok, now that I've made fun of myself, feel free to mention that I kinda suck at the Kumbaya thing, too-- too opiniated!).  The true jewel of democracy is having rules that allow you to work with those you disagree with (including your close relatives and fellow Democratic Committee members) in a spirit of mutual respect.  Discussing, debating, deliberating the issues, and coming, through negotiation and compromise, to an agreement.

That process actually happens in the Assembly Democratic conference, but, unfortunately, almost nobody sees that.  So, The Albany Political Theatre Show is what the voters mostly see, and it is a manipulative game that has little to do with with democracy.  While I mostly agree wholeheartedly with Simon's excellent post above, I have less trust that changing the cast of characters will make any difference.  I truly, truly believe that it is rules, not persons, that make democracy work.  Laws, not men, for those of you used to the traditional (sexist) phraseology.

Where to start to effect reform?  Well, it's a bit of a chicken and egg problem-- except the state is suffering mightily while we try to puzzle out which comes first, reform legislation, reform-style legislators, reform-style leadership, voter re-engagement.... JFK probably had it right.  Ask not what (NYS government) can do for you, ask what you can do for (NYS government).  No silver bullet, no change in leadership, no election will do the trick alone.  It has to be a group project, and, as Simon points out, it may take a while.  With disappointments along the way.

It is always ever so much easier to criticize what is wrong than to plan a trajectory toward what is right.  For some,  "more and better Democrats" and an emphasis on electoral change will be just the ticket.  For others of us, an emphasis on structural (rules and policies) change will be the place to start.  If TAP is to continue in its role as a public-space for incubation of democratic reform, various views must continue to be welcome.  Where does reform start?  Well, where are you?  That would be a good place.  I'm going to get busy and write that week-late Reform Day diary, for my part.  And, for those who are checking, no Speaker Silver did not address us this year.  Not sure why.

Also: I continue to believe that Silver the Scapegoat is 100% a part of the current dysfunctionality.  It is hardly unusual for Shelly to take the darts for whatever it is that the Assembly does that is not palatable to some interest group.  That is, in fact, a big part of what I would like to see changed.  And, not by making some other legislator Speaker, by changing the culture.

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by: robinia @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 15:15:44 PM UTC

One more (large) point... (4.00 / 2)

I must clarify that there is a difference between what some call infighting and what others might considering holding their party accountable. Too often if you are doing the latter, you are accused of the former. I know from experience. We have a local government official in Orleans County (a Democrat) who was arrested for DWI, was having an extra-marital affair and had nude photographs on the Internet. I called for his resignation and was attacked for it by fellow Democrats. So this is not new terrain for me.

Being from a Republican county, I have seen how Republicans rule. They are terrible at governing and I expect nothing from any Republican in local or state office. They have done nothing for me at a local level and the Republican majority in the Senate has only helped wound New York even more.

Therefore, I expect a lot out of Democrats. Again, I don't see many differences on the issues with Silver. If I were to sit down with Silver and go head to head on the issues, I bet you we would agree nine times out of 10. Certainly, there have been a few issues over time where Silver has upset some people, but that comes with the territory.

The problem is leadership. Silver is safe as speaker and I would hope he would use that for good. Instead of just going along with this aforementioned culture in Albany, why not stand up and say that we need to change things?

I'm glad Robinia mentioned Reform Day. His absence speaks volumes. Maybe he was busy with legislative items... who knows.

Finally, awhile back this blog was accused of showing favoritism to the Senate Democrats over the Assembly Democrats. So this issue isn't new here. I know that I show favoritism to all Democrats. Sheldon Silver and Joe Bruno both have similar styles in leadership and approach. The problem is that Silver is the Democrat and I (and perhaps WE) expect better from him. I expect nothing from Bruno. After all, what has the Senate Majority done for you lately?  

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by: robert.harding @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 16:54:37 PM UTC

Well-said (0.00 / 0)

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by: Roatti @ Thu May 08, 2008 at 17:20:54 PM UTC

[ Parent ]