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The Winners And Losers After The Equality Vote

by: robert.harding

Thu Dec 03, 2009 at 05:32:01 AM EST


The vote for marriage equality failed today by a 38 to 24 vote. While this is a sad day in New York, it is also a positive one. The vote today, while not the result we wanted, is a first step in the pursuit of equality. We know where we stand. We have 24 votes. We need eight more.

The disappointing fact is that in the Democratic conference, we had eight members who voted against equality. There were five who had hinted that they were definitely no votes or possible no votes. We knew that Senator Ruben Diaz Sr. was going to vote no. He wanted to suspend democracy by not having a vote at all (he considered it "treason" today that a vote was even held, regardless of the outcome) and has been the Senate's most outspoken critic of marriage equality, even outdoing the 30 members of the Republican conference who have said very little on the subject.

The other seven Democrats who voted against the bill with Diaz are:

- Joseph Addabbo
- Darrel Aubertine
- Shirley Huntley
- Carl Kruger
- Hiram Monserrate
- George Onorato
- Bill Stachowski

So who won this round of the marriage fight in New York? Who lost? Here are those answers.

WINNERS
Marriage Equality Advocates: It might not feel like it now, but this is a small victory. It's not the outcome groups like Empire State Pride Agenda wanted, but it is a vote. It gives them what they need to push forward and help primary some of these Democrats (Onorato and Huntley come to mind) who voted against the bill and prevented equality.

Gang Of Four: Remember the original "Gang of Four?" It consisted of Diaz, Pedro Espada, Kruger and Monserrate. Three of those four voted against the bill today and played a part in assuring the failure of this bill. Only Espada, who argued passionately for equality, voted for it. But this goes to show that the so-called "Amigos" shouldn't have been negotiated with in the first place and voted against the Democratic conference.

Republicans: It is hard to argue that the more united party in the state senate is the Republican Party. It was speculated that a few Republicans would break with their party and vote for this bill. In the end, none of them did. Of course, this could be a politically convenient for some, since such a vote would draw the ire of social conservatives within the party and with Republicans like Vincent Leibell being subjected to a primary, but they come away from this vote unscathed (for the most part).

LOSERS
Senator Tom Duane: On several occasions, Duane has said he has the votes to pass this. In the end, that was wishful thinking. The leading voice for marriage equality in the Senate and the Senate's only openly gay member was eight votes off of what he needed to pass a bill that is very important to him personally and politically.

Democratic Conference: Like Duane, the conference made the mistake of indicating that they might have the votes and expressed feelings of optimism. The vote should have taken place, but the overconfidence could have been left at the door. They had no less than 22 votes to start with and ended up with 24. It wasn't even close. It is good that they brought it to the floor for a vote - a rarity in Albany when a bill faces such uncertainty - but saying it might pass was overdoing it.

Queens Democrats: The excuses are plenty. In Addabbo's case, it is the Catholic Church's pressure. In Huntley's case, it is her predominantly African American district. As Yorkvillian pointed out in another thread, these districts are represented in the Assembly by progressives AND supporters of marriage equality. So the argument that they had to vote against equality is weak. Credit goes to Malcolm Smith and Toby Ann Stavisky for voting in favor of the bill.

Governor David Paterson was not a winner or loser. He called for a vote and he got what he called for. In that sense, he was a winner. As a supporter of marriage equality, he didn't win, but it wasn't his job to pass the bill. His job is to sign it. He won't have that chance.

This vote will have consequences for both parties. There will be primaries for Democrats next year. Will this vote be the sole reason for that? No. There are Democrats who were being eyed for primaries before (Huntley, Monserrate, Onorato) whose votes won't help them and will only make the case against them stronger.

It is a disappointing outcome, but at least it is an outcome. This starting point will be helpful for future votes.  

robert.harding :: The Winners And Losers After The Equality Vote
Tags: , , , , , (All Tags)
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I do hope we're able to pick at least a few (0.00 / 0)
of these Democrats off in the primary. The right is not the least bit afraid to Scouzzfava their own when the vote for gay equality.

Only by making Democrats equally afraid to vote against equality will we see progress. So long as Dems are free to vote this way, without payback, they will. And why wouldn't they?


The whacko right has something the progressive left doesn't... (0.00 / 0)
...money.

They are incredibly well funded and the left isn't.

We are looking to replace as many on both sides as possible.

ReBootNY.org.

We've got some work ahead of us.


[ Parent ]
Bigotry won the vote but lost the day (4.00 / 1)
It shouldn't go without mention that Diaz was the only opponent to speak against the bill.

I watched the live feed, and Senator after Senator after Senator took the floor to share passionate, intelligent and eloquent arguments in the bill's favor.

The silence from the opponents is testament that they haven't got an argument to make anymore, aside from Diaz's description we should follow the Bible and the examples of Louisiana and Alabama (Really, Rueben?)

Their silence speaks to their shame, and their need to hide their actions from the public. Why would they not want to go on record? Why were their "no" votes practically whispered? Why would they not want to have the newspapers and video cameras record their righteous action on behalf of the people? Are they not proud of themselves?

I think it was all very telling.


No video trail if they don't speak. (0.00 / 0)
No commercials to be used against them.

We've got some work ahead of us.

[ Parent ]
We can make them infamous (0.00 / 0)
where the term of "infamy" would apply.

[ Parent ]
You forgot one entry in the "loser" category... (4.00 / 3)
The people of New York.  

I tend to disagree Robert, as I do (4.00 / 1)
Winners:
Christian Right (Their issue)
Republican Leadership (like you said)
My Aunt (whose been standing outside the capitol with signs every week and having her home schooled kids call offices daily for four months)
Good Government (we actually forced Senators to go on the record by having a vote on an issue that people were scared to go speak up on, for once)

Losers:
Homosexuals who wanted to get married (obvious)
Marriage Equality Advocates (can't imagine how you think this is a win for them)
Democratic Leadership (couldn't hold the votes together)
Duane (as you said)
Kos (For calling it when nothing had changed since May and it was pretty obvious it was doomed)


Yeah. Enough with the happy talk. (0.00 / 0)
I've read on several blogs now this spin that getting slammed by a 14-vote margin in a 62-vote chamber is a victory.

"It's not the outcome groups like Empire State Pride Agenda wanted, but it is a vote."

Yeah, OK. Just like Vietnam didn't turn out the way we wanted, but at least it was a war. Wait, what?

There is a cardinal rule in politics: You don't call for a vote until you know you've got the votes. Up until hours before the actual vote, we were being told (including by this site) that things were looking up. The harsh reality is that the advocates got badly surprised and rebuked.

Does this make it easier to primary those who voted no? I'd like to think so. But was that the plan all along? Hardly. This was a failure of advocacy, and rather than spinning it as a "small victory" people ought to be figuring out what went so awry.


[ Parent ]
Nice comparison Hudson... (4.00 / 1)
Yeah, OK. Just like Vietnam didn't turn out the way we wanted, but at least it was a war. Wait, what?

As acknowledged by the Brennan Center, bringing any issue up for a vote without the outcome already known is a rare thing in the New York State Legislature. You don't bring anything to a vote unless it passes. That is the norm in Albany.

This is why you are hearing at least it's a vote. Plus, you are hearing it for another reason: Nothing puts your senators on the record like a roll call vote. All we had before was speculation. We had nothing concrete that put the 62 senators on the record regarding marriage equality. So yes, while it's not the outcome we wanted, we know where we stand. We have no less than 24 votes for civil rights. We need eight more.

Before we had no idea who we needed to work on. Now we do. I don't get the Vietnam reference (kind of overkill, if you ask me) but this vote, while a failed vote, was important. We needed this. It gives us something to work with so that, down the road, we can pass marriage equality.

Support our troops, not the war.


[ Parent ]
I don't see how (4.00 / 1)
Learning the same information at the same time as your opposition is an advantage - now they know whose on their side for sure too.

[ Parent ]
The playing field isn't level (0.00 / 0)
The opponents are afraid to go on record. Doesn't that strike you as telling, the fact that only one in 38 publicly defended their vote?

[ Parent ]
not really (0.00 / 0)
Addabbo posted his opposition on his Facebook wall...ON FACEBOOK OF ALL PLACES. So it doesn't tell me anything except they just want to move on from this issue, it annoys them.


[ Parent ]
When? (0.00 / 0)
When did Addabbo post this?  Was it before the vote?

[ Parent ]
Nah. This is a post-defeat spin. (4.00 / 1)
It's notable that this spin only came up after the shock of the vote.

Before the vote it was, "Things are looking pretty good!"

After the vote it's, "Uhhmmmm, we just wanted to get 'em on record."


[ Parent ]
I totally disagree (0.00 / 0)
How would this issue have changed had they not voted? How would we not still be in the same place we are at this moment? What was lost? Had they not voted,  we'd still be waiting for next year, next cycle.

Addabbo collected $9,500 from NY's Human Rights Campaign last cycles, and tens of thousands more from other GLBT groups and individuals. Wasted money on their part. We don't have much business left at the state level, having job protection, hate crimes. etc.

We can find other people to funnel our money to next cycle. And now we know who to drop from our fundraisers.

http://gay.americablog.com/200...


[ Parent ]
I'm sorry, silly me. (4.00 / 1)
I'm sure the Gay community is overjoyed at the result.

[ Parent ]
Ok, too much information for you (0.00 / 0)
to answer substantially. I'll narrow it down to one question:

How would not voting have put Marriage Equality advocates in a better position than they are today?


[ Parent ]
Missing the point entirely. (4.00 / 1)
That's not what the outcome of the vote got you. You won the battle to have a vote months ago, and that is not at all what this "round of the marriage battle" is about.

This round can not possible be seen as anything but a KO for gay marriage in NYS for the next three years, maybe more if we don't keep control of the Senate for redistricting.

And if these people here are serious about defeating Aubertine, Stachowski and such because of this vote, we wont control redistricting, the Republicans will draw themselves 3 extra seats, and we can write off this happening for a decade, as a direct result of this vote.


[ Parent ]
HOW? (0.00 / 0)
be seen as anything but a KO for gay marriage in NYS

How? How is it worse now, than it was Monday morning?
serious about defeating Aubertine, Stachowski

Defeating in a primary and sending a progressive lamb to the General slaughter?

I agree. I think there's almost no real world chance of that happening.


[ Parent ]
Because we could've waited until redistricting (4.00 / 1)
and redrawn the districts so people like Addabbo would fear you more than the Catholic Church.

We knew who was always opposed...Diaz, Onorato, Aubertine, Stachowski, they were always opposed to the bill. We didn't need a vote to tell us that.


[ Parent ]
What we didn't know (0.00 / 0)
We didn't know how tightly Skelos would actually hold on to Lanza, Alesi and others in his caucus.  Lanza is probably safe, because there aren't any strong Democrats in the southern part of Staten Island; I don't know how things are around Rochester.

We also didn't have this major fundraising issue -- the LGBT community is going to fill the coffers of several Democrats in currently red senate districts, probably starting with two or three on Long Island (Lavalle, Hannon and Owen Johnson come to mind).  Those fights could also give Jay Jacobs the opportunity he needs to redeem himself after this year's disasters in his back yard.

This vote may actually keep the senate in Democratic hands after next year, and give us the power of redistricting -- which will mean two or three more seats in 2012.


[ Parent ]
Gay marriage is going to be so far down on the list (0.00 / 0)
of concerns with people, this isn't even going to register, so any Democrat hoping to rid the LGBT community's support in any of these districts is kidding themselves.

I think the only one even remotely vulnerable on the issue is Frank Padavan, and only because of the amount of young voters in the district and rising number of LGBT constituents, but his district still demographically looks like Addabbos, socially conservative Catholics, and I don't expect young voters to be rushing to the polls to vote against Padavan over this issue.

Lanza, Alesi, Johnson and Little all probably decided, correctly IMO, that they are more vulnerable in a GOP primary than in a general over the issue.


[ Parent ]
And are you saying they've been OVERJOYED (0.00 / 0)
I'm sure the Gay community is overjoyed at the result.

for low these many years they've asked for a vote and been ignored?

[ Parent ]
$9,500 (0.00 / 0)
that's it? hmm. Considering the warchest he's sitting on, that's chump change.  

[ Parent ]
What I want to know (4.00 / 2)
Where the fuck was WFP?  

I'm not gonna rock the boat. Rockin' the boat's a drag. What you do is sink the boat!
- Truth and Soul, Inc.


Interesting question. (4.00 / 1)
I'd like an answer to that as well.

We've got some work ahead of us.

[ Parent ]
Their website is nuetral last I checked (4.00 / 1)
with only general platitudes about equality, but no specific position on marriage equality or any other issues, as far as I saw last time.

Thus far, I've seen that translate into, "We're OK with throwing the gay contingent under the bus in the name of pragmatism, when push comes to shove."

I hope we can see more leadership out of them in the future.


[ Parent ]
Has nothing to do with their core platform (4.00 / 1)
Which is pro-union.

[ Parent ]
Right (0.00 / 0)
and Sirota talks about this in "The Uprising".  They are entirely economic oriented.  That's why Aubertine was a fantastic candidate for them; they don't care about his social conservatism and they WANT to pick up "socially conservative economically liberal" voters.

Don't expect anything from WFP on marriage equality.  We're on our own.

"Never be afraid to stand with the minority when the minority is right, for the minority which is right will one day be the majority."


-William Jennings Bryan


[ Parent ]
But are "Labor" issues mutually exclusive of (4.00 / 2)
civil rights issues? Am I to take it that LGBT concerns and those of unions never meet? Are there no gay union members?

Besides, if paid family leave is an economic issue worthy of their attention, why shouldn't the 1,300 rights conferred upon married couples be?

If that's the way WFP wants to play it, fine. They can do whatever they like. They should probably stop asking me for money though. I'll spend it elsewhere.


I'm not gonna rock the boat. Rockin' the boat's a drag. What you do is sink the boat!
- Truth and Soul, Inc.


[ Parent ]
There are certainly gay union members (2.00 / 2)
There are also certainly Christian Conservatives too.

The WFP is not the counterpart to the Conservative party. It is a corrupt operation out of Queens that destroys good candidates who wont pay them off, and is a great example of all that is wrong with New York State Government. It is nothing else.


[ Parent ]
I must take exception to your statement, sir. (0.00 / 0)
I thought their headquarters were in Brooklyn!

"Never be afraid to stand with the minority when the minority is right, for the minority which is right will one day be the majority."


-William Jennings Bryan


[ Parent ]
Labor supports equality (0.00 / 0)
The state AFL-CIO supports marriage equality.  The first member union to push for that stand was the bricklayer's union (which is where George Onorato comes from).

But WFP is, despite its image and even its monetary supporters, an entity unto itself, dedicated to perpetuating itself and gaining power for itself -- and nothing else.  As such, this entity will not take a stand on a controversial issue that it can't make its own issue.

WFP did campaign hard against extending term limits in NYC.  But that was not a controversial issue (87% of NYC residents were also opposed), and WFP was able to have the image, at least, of being the lead group in opposition.  That's why WFP took that position.


[ Parent ]
You make very excellent points (4.00 / 1)
perhaps we should schedule you for a sit-down with WFP to argue why they should get onboard and why marriage equality enhances, not distracts from the fight for their core principles?

[ Parent ]
WFP is Pro-Marriage Equality (4.00 / 3)
Hey Everyone -

Just to set the record straight here, the WFP does support marriage equality and was one of the many groups working in Albany this week to try to pass it.  

The WFP has been supporting marriage equality since a (unanimous)vote last year, and has been active trying to build support among moderate dems since then.  See, for example here.

Our website actually makes this pretty clear i think, btw - it says "The Working Families Party supports efforts to open marriage to all Americans, regardless of sexual orientation."

Like so many New Yorkers, we were deeply saddened to see the Senate vote marriage equality down this week, and we hope they there will be another, more successful vote soon.

Also, FYI - almost the entire New York labor movement is also behind marriage equality.  


[ Parent ]
Enough to pull endorsements of the eight senators who voted no? (4.00 / 1)
Not that I'm pushing the WFP to do it, but activists are going to be looking at that.

I wish I had seen this thread earlier, otherwise I would've pointed that when I worked for PBS, both Tish James and Patricia Eddington, who are elected WFP members, strongly endorsed marriage equality when they were asked on our programs.  


[ Parent ]
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