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The Nachbar Negatives

by: rottenchester

Wed May 02, 2007 at 23:17:30 PM EDT


(Rottenchester, who writes the truly superb Fighting 29th, doesn't usually crosspost, but I asked and he agreed because he believes that "this is such a revolting development." Many thanks to him for this excellent post. - promoted by lipris)

Today, commenters on my blog, The Fighting 29th and on Rochesterturning have been eviscerating the announcement of David Nachbar's candidacy.  Lipris asked me to cross post my take.  Here it is:

David Nachbar's candidacy, if pursued, will be a disaster for the Democrats in the 29th. I say this knowing only a little bit about Nachbar, but I would say it even if he were the second coming of Christ fused with the ghost of JFK presented in the corporeal shell of Barack Obama.

I agree with those who say that a candidate from the North can't win for structural reasons. More importantly, a wealthy candidate from Pittsford is even more surely doomed to fail in the primary as well as the general election. The reasons for this encompass both pride and pragmatism.

Unlike Monroe County, where the local newspapers barely cover any Members of Congress, the Southern newspapers are all over their representative. In addition, Kuhl is often the featured speaker at important events, like commencement exercises. Replacing a local resident who's in touch with the needs of the Southern Tier with an executive from Monroe County (someone whose knowledge of that part of the district might be limited to a couple of winery tours) would be a huge blow to the pride of people in the South. It would be tantamount to losing representation.

More pragmatically, someone who lives in the Southern Tier is well-acquainted with the needs of that part of the district, which are quite different from those of the North. Let's begin with agriculture. Though this certainly isn't Massa or Kuhl's strong point, both have spent years (or decades, in Kuhl's case) listening to farmers. Nachbar and his wife have built a horse barn on their property, but I doubt that he's going to resonate with farmers. Nor is his experience in upper-middle-class Pittsford prepared him to understand the issues of the relatively poor Southern 29th. The towns in that part of the state are hurting. Unless they're represented by someone who lives in their area, the residents of the Southern 29th will fear that their representative will focus too much time and attention on the needs of the relatively wealthy Northern suburbs.

For Southerners, the presence of an hard-working Congressman who understands their needs is absolutely critical to the well-being of their part of the state. Instead of Republicans crossing over to support Massa, as we saw in 2006, we'll see Democrats pulling the Kuhl lever in the highly unlikely event that Nachbar makes it to the general election.

Now let's look at the pernicious influence of Louise Slaughter in all of this.

rottenchester :: The Nachbar Negatives
Louise Slaughter clearly doesn't like Eric Massa. I have yet to see anything more than the most perfunctory endorsement of Massa from her. Louise didn't campaign last election because of a case of the shingles, but her office didn't work for Massa either. Louise pushed Nachbar in 2006, and he wisely withdrew in the face of Massa's quality candidacy. In 2008, apparently Nachbar and Slaughter have decided that announcing early is a wise strategy, and it is: their Machiavellian scheme will prevent Massa from doing any major fundraising and choke off his campaign for a solid year.

By declaring herself for Nachbar, Slaughter will freeze a lot of the national money that would have otherwise have come Massa's way. As the chair of the powerful House Rules committee, Louise is a person that potential donors won't want to cross. So, instead of sending Massa some coin, those donors will either stay out or support Nachbar. It really doesn't matter, since Nachbar has enough money to self-finance the primary. Massa hasn't cashed in millions of B&L stock options, so the effect of the Nachbar announcement on his campaign will be debilitating.

Massa's dead right when he says that $3 million is what it's going to take to win the 29th. The Nachbar candidacy, with Slaughter's support, will effectively deny him that kind of money. Whether or not Massa wins the primary (and he will win it), Nachbar's candidacy will hobble Massa's effort in the general election. Massa's fundraising goal can only be achieved with a two-year effort, and without money, Massa is a sure loser.

This seems completely bloody obvious to me, yet it seems to escape a wily politician like Slaughter. Why? The simple answer is that Louise Slaughter has no reason to understand the North/South dynamic in the 29th. She's completely out of touch with party leaders and party rank-and-file in the Southern Tier. Her focus is on Rochester and its ring suburbs. It's natural that she'd look to consolidate her power in Monroe County by hand-picking a protégé.

No politician is immune to the arrogance of power, and this move reeks of it. For those of you who watched the 2006 election closely, consider this equation: David Nachbar is to Louise Slaughter as Tammy Duckworth was to Rahm Emanuel.

Before leaving the topic of Louise, I want to deal with a comment Bud made earlier today. He noted that Louise's choice of Nachbar indicates that the "Washington establishment considers Massa a loser". I'd like to hear the reasons behind that, if Bud is interested in sharing them. I certainly agree that Slaughter risks leaving that impression. But I think the real truth here is that the establishment senses that Massa is a man who can't be controlled. When the Democrats were desperate in '06, they were willing to hold their noses and tolerate rebels like Massa (or James Webb). Now that they have the reins back, those type of mavericks aren't to the taste of the entrenched Democratic powerbrokers. They want someone who won't buck when the saddle is cinched up. Massa is not that man.

Finally, let's examine the impact of this announcement on Randy Kuhl, the man who's celebrating his second birthday, Christmas, New Year's and July 4th today. After performing cartwheels in his House office, Randy will bide his time until after the 2008 primary, which is exactly the strategy he's wanted to follow since the day after the 2006 election. Randy will love watching Massa and Nachbar argue over bullshit like which one wants troops out of Iraq faster. Every minute of primary coverage is a minute where Massa is unable to stick it to Kuhl. Kuhl will exit the primary season tanned, rested and ready to spend his enormous campaign chest on obliterating Massa over the airwaves of the 29th.

David Nachbar's candidacy represents the worst in insular party politics. I hope he comes to his senses and pulls out, but I fear that Louise's hand-picked candidate will be in it for the long haul.

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thanks for having this cross posted, lipris (4.00 / 1)
We're apoplectic here in NY-29 over this development.  Anyone got any ideas about how to talk some sense into Slaughter?

Can smugtown ever be saved from itself? (4.00 / 2)
This is a very insightful post.

I think you are calling it exactly right on Slaughter (and, also, the hubris that would propel a rich guy from Pittsford to think he is the right candidate).

Simon is right, the district is gerrymandered something ridiculous... (note, when made fireproof by the Powers, Reynolds proceeded to set self on fire.  Sheesh.).  This gerrymandering not only balances the Suburban Roch dems against the Steuben Co bedrock reps... it also encourages this kind of dem candidacy.  Because, all the wealthy Roch suburban folk think that the Southern Tier is just someplace to own a second home, or, as you mention, to go for a wine tour.  Of course, they should be in charge-- they are like that.

The Rochester area power structure needs very badly to be saved from its own absurdly high opinion of itself.  It is outdated.  They only think they are better off than the Southern Tier.  At least in the Southern Tier, they are facing up to the situation.  The Pittsford crew is still coasting on their Kodak buyouts and pretending there isn't a massive decline.  Dangerous dreaming.


Not Buying It (0.00 / 0)
First, to clear the record I support Eric Massa.  I voluntered for him and helped raise money for him with the help of my brother.  However, I need to point out that Slaughter has not endorsed either candidate this cycle and I don't expect her to for some time, so I think jumping on the attack Slaughter bandwagon is somewhat off abse and presumptive.  Also, the lack of enodrsement from her last cycle in large part came from some nasty exchanges from the Massa camp that she stay out of that district.  I hate to say it, but in many ways it reminded me of how Lieberman reacted to being challenged by Lamont.

With that being said, I don't understand the uproar over ANY candidate putting their hat in the ring.  Let us not forget that Massa did lose last time and while right now I give him a better shot at taking down Kuhl than anyone else, including Nachbar, that has emerged le tus not limit ourselves to the possiblity that no one will.


[ Parent ]
Not Presumptive at All (4.00 / 1)
Even the Democrat and Chronicle story on Nachbar's announcement acknowledged that Nachbar was backed by Slaughter in 2006 in an "effort to derail Massa's candidacy".  IMO, it's naive to think that, absent an endorsement, Slaughter is not taking a position in this race. Nachbar is her candidate, period.

[ Parent ]
I disagree (0.00 / 0)
The D&C acknowledged that she supported him last cycle, not this cycle.  Again, I am not saying that she will not come out with support for him at some point, but until then it is counter productive to act as though she has. 


[ Parent ]
C'mon (0.00 / 0)
Slaughter's support of Nachbar in '06 was more than just saying he was her choice for a candidate.  My understanding is that Slaughter courted him, and that Nachbar has little or no track record in the Democratic party (he might have been a registered Republican at that time).  I don't think it's a stretch to think that a man she courted in '06 wouldn't jump in unless he was sure of her support in '08.

[ Parent ]
Let me put it this way (0.00 / 0)
Is Wesley Clark the Clinton candidate simply because he was supported by both Clintons last cycle?  The thing is, Slaughter stayed out of the race after Nachbar lost to Massa because the Massa Camp lashed out at Slaughter for saying anything about the race, something about staying within her own district and out of their business.  That is the primary reason that she never came out with any kind of public support for him last time around.

Needn't I remind anyone here that she did give quite a bit in the use it or lose it campaign for other races as well.  She isn't shy about coming out for support of local candidates (she her recent endorsement of a local county leg candidate), but in this case the fuel was spawned entirely by the Massa camp.

Again, I support Eric and have been active in my support, but I simply think people are flying way off base on this one.  Even if she does actually support Nachbar this time around, there is still no announcement other than the D&C saying taht she supported him last time around.  Is that really enough for anyone to go in on?


[ Parent ]
Rotten's right (0.00 / 0)
If I had spoken to anyone -- anyone -- who was politically connected who didn't think that Nachbar was Slaughter's boy, I might feel differently, but I haven't: Rotten is 100% right that this is Slaughter's doing. 

And it's stupid.  No one who knows this district thinks he could beat Kuhl running from Pittsford.  No one. 


[ Parent ]
this has her fingerprints all over it. (0.00 / 0)
i actually really like louise. i really like eric as well. i don't understand her problem with massa.

but, it is beginning to piss me off.

TODAY is day one. It always is.


[ Parent ]
Before We Get Too Worked Up Into a Froth (0.00 / 0)
Let me state upfront that I'm supporting Eric Massa in 2008, just as I had in 2006.  Having said that:

Please recall that Massa himself only moved into the Southern Tier in 2001 (thus, the whole North versus South thing seems a bit of a stretch), and initially registered as a Republican, switching party affiliations in the spring of 2004.  That year, he briefly considered a primary challenge against Samara Barend, but was dissuaded at least in part because of concerns over his johnny-come-lately status.

So it's not exactly like this situation is unpercedented.


Exactly (0.00 / 0)
As I recall reading through the DFA Rochester message boards from before they endorsed Massa, there was some real reservations about his character as an ex-Repub and his opinions.  Understandably, he won them over, but lets not forget what the opinions once were and assume that there can be no primary challenger.

[ Parent ]
This Situation is Different (4.00 / 1)
Barend didn't have the track record Massa has - that's the difference.

And, yes, the fact that Massa recently moved to Corning is an issue, and Kuhl made it one in the campaign.  But he's the best you're going to get from the South.  The election of a couple of Dems to city offices is notable because it's rare and new.  Most of the Republicans in the South run without Democratic challengers.  Massa's accomplishment goes beyond his candidacy.  He's energized a group of downtrodden Democrats, and brought new hope for change to an area that badly needs it.

My rhetoric may seem frothing, but it's almost impossible to overstate the impact that Massa's made in that part of the district. 


[ Parent ]
Don't forget (0.00 / 0)
Massa was in the Navy for 24 years... If you know about navy Families, you know they often have no say in where they live... I sincerely doubt he moved to a district which nobody thought was winnable at the time because he wanted to cherry pick a seat the way Nachbar is doing

[ Parent ]
Louise (4.00 / 1)
Louise is trying to deny it now - but she refused to take phone calls or meet with Democratic Chairs from the Southern Tier who wanted to talk to her about what she was doing with Nachbar.  Now that people are protesting, she claims that she responded to all the concerns raised to her.  If she did respond to them, her response was to blow them off, literally saying in the case of one party chair that their opinions didn't matter because their county was unimportant.  Does she think that the whole district outside of Monroe is unimportant?  Because that certainly is the impression she's giving.  I sent a letter to Louise asking her to reconsider what she was doing, and her letter back told me to address my concerns to my own representative - who of course is Randy Kuhl.  This is at least the third Congressional election in a row in the 29th District where Louise has tried to stir up a primary.  Primaries are not necessarily bad things.  But I think that we the citizens along with Democratic party leaders of the 29th are fully capable of coming up with our own candidates and making our own decisions, and quite frankly we resent having a Pittsford millionaire hoisted on us by outside forces.  Nachbar's a spoiler and his only impact will be to harm Massa's plans for fundraisers with big-name politicians who are afraid to cross Louise. By the way, Louise was pushing Nachbar in Washington and telling everyone there was going to be a primary well over a month ago.

Letter Sent Back (0.00 / 0)
Louise would have sent your letter back because your address would have indicated that you were outside her district.  This was not due to the fact that she felt as though your concern was not valid or that she felt as though all districts/counties/towns outside of her own are unimportant.  Rather, it is a matter of congressional ethics/courtesy that all correspondence written to representatives outside of their district be re-directed to the proper district.  Consider the mess that we would all be in if reps just took on whatever tasks asked of them by whomever outside of their district!  They already represent 600,000 people!! 

Also, it is a really crazy thought to think that she sits and weedles through all correspondence herself.  Does anyone here have any idea how much mail each individual congressional office receives, let alone phone calls, let alone faxes and lets not forget the schedule that each one keeps.  This doesn't just go for her, but for all of them. 

Again, I need to stress that I am a Massa supporter, I have done work for him on my own and with other volunteers, but I think that we all need to actually focus on what we need to do rather than all of a sudden jumping on the crush Louise bandwagon and canabilizing ourselves. 


[ Parent ]
RE: Letter sent back (0.00 / 0)
I think the more important part of my post was her blow-off of those people calling her office with concerns. Funny, you didn't address that, Mark JB.  Sounds like you may work for the Congresswoman? She has been a stone wall in dealing with chairs from the southern tier on this.  I understand she is now claiming that residents from the 29th have "threatened" her and spread lies about her meddling in our district.  The people I've spoken to  have been polite but firm and gotten nowhere. Nobody is threatening her, but they do want to understand why she's done what she did and persuade her to change her mind. She won't explain.  She is not denying the basic facts about Nachbar and what she's done. I again repeat:  let the people of the 29th - not Louise Slaughter - decide thier own candidates.

[ Parent ]
For the record (0.00 / 0)
First of all, no I am not paid by Louise.  Second of all, don't you find it hypocritical that she is getting malgined for at once not supporting one candidate, but perhaps supporting another? Also, please provide some kind of link or other info to back up the supposed quotes of her saying that she was threatened?

Finally, not only is it unethical for employees of Louise, or any representative for that matter, to discuss matters of campaigns from her offices (aside from a campaign office), but it is ILLEGAL.  Thus, you will get a line from people from her office, OR ANY OFFICE, that might sound to you like you were blown off when in fact they were following the law!

Also, again for the record, I don't disagree that someone from the north will be unable to win this district.  I still think that it is dubious at best to beleive that a democrat from the south can win this district, but I do support Massa!  I have gone out of my way in order to make my support well known and although I haven't done as much as others that I know I believe in Eric, in what he stands for, and in his ability as a leader.  The better issue here is to stand up and be accounted for with our own actions in support of him, in writing LTE's and blogging about this issue, in donating and going door to door.  After all this is a democracy and while we may not like all the candidates or their motives we have to accept them and in the end support the candidates that inspire us and show that they can actually lead us to where we need to be.  Obviously I think Eric is that guy.


[ Parent ]
So, uh... (4.00 / 1)
How exactly should residents of the 29th contact Congresswoman Slaughter to ask her to stay out of the politics in their district?

It seems broken that she's willing to support a candidate in the district but won't accept mail from people who think she shouldn't be meddling in that district...


[ Parent ]
call her DC office (4.00 / 1)
(202) 225-3615

[ Parent ]
that would be fine (0.00 / 0)
because they will make sure that comments are seen by her, but keep in mind that ANY employee of her or any other representative is bound by the LAW about what they are able to say when they are in a DO or LO because it is illegal to do any kind of campaigning from an office.  As such, you will get better and more frank answers from a campaign office.

[ Parent ]
And does said campaign office exist? (0.00 / 0)
I mean, really, do we need to write letters to her house?


[ Parent ]
I'm sure (0.00 / 0)
that if you called any one of her offices they would be able to get you a number to call.  I'm really not sure why the snark is needed here since its just the friggin law.

[ Parent ]
It's not snark (0.00 / 0)
It just sounds very much like the 29th is getting the runaround from a neighboring district, which is really a  pretty strange situation when you think about.

[ Parent ]
Good rec'd call to arms on Kos tonite about this (4.00 / 1)
Let me just suggest (4.00 / 1)
...without taking any position whatsoever on the substance of this, that Louise Slaughter is both an admirable legislator and a dedicated Progressive, and that those suggesting improper motives for her actions have a high burden of proof that remains substantially unmet. It might be worthwhile exploring where her posited dislike of Massa comes from, and whether it's an out-of-touch power grab, which would be entirely out of character, or something else.

Thank You (0.00 / 0)
More or less what I have been trying to say.  In my experience with Louise, which is somewhat extensive, I have never known her to act in the manner that she is being accused.  Is that to say it is entirely possible that she is acting in the manner she is being accused?  Of course, but as you stated the burden of proof is on those people to prove it! 

[ Parent ]
Yup. (0.00 / 0)
Like I said, I have no intention of getting mired in this particular flamewar, but I'm surprised at the vitriol here. Someone like Slaughter deserves to have her positions analyzed with more of a presumption of good faith.

[ Parent ]
The Nachbar Negatives (0.00 / 0)
I don't mean to play the atheist at the altar here, but even with the annoying tendency of Democrats to eat their own, you have to consider Louise's actions and Bud's comment about the DC establishment's opinion of Massa from a viewpoint other than that of one of his clearly ardent supporters. 

Frankly, Massa did everything he could to piss off the Democratic Party leadership in 2006, from Rahm on down, and he ran one of the most undisciplined, wasteful campaigns in modern history - except maybe for Kerry '04. He's a lousy candidate (if I never see that frothing-at-the-mouth, Captain Queeg-on-angel-dust routine of his again, it'll still be too soon) and he has a bad habit of saying stupid things - very loudly - in public to the wrong people.

John Hall, Jerry McNereney and a few others ran "outsider" races in red districts without a lot of money or support from the DCCC and won, and Linda Stender and Darcy Burner and some others got DCCC support and lost. And guess what?  Stender and Burner are back and running again, with no apparent "backstabbing" going on by neighboring congresswomen, or full-fledged recruitment efforts of primary opponents by the local and national Democratic party, and McNerney and Hall are being featured at a major fundraising event this month put on by the DCCC with new chair Chris Van Hollen appearing as guest speaker.  And Massa?  He's getting dumped before he even gets to the dance.

So what's the problem here? Well, it's certainly not that "Massa is a man who can't be controlled". It's more that Massa is a man who can't control himself, and that is DEATH in politics.  The real reasons he's going to bite it this time are he clearly doesn't play well with others, he can't raise a dime on his own, and in 2006 when he saw nobody was buying what he was selling, he did the one thing you absolutely cannot do: he publicly talked shit about everybody who wasn't totally supporting him...hmm, sound like anybody else we know?

And another thing: Even if Massa had a wide open road to the nomination, there is no way in hell he could raise $3M in 2 years, or 2,000 for that matter! If he couldn't raise money in the tidal wave of '06 - where Dem fundraising equaled or bettered Republicans in battleground districts across the country -  he certainly won't be able to do it in this election with the vacuum that is HRC sucking New York dry (sorry, Bill). Hell, Massa couldn't even muster enough appeal to win the DFA Grassroots All-Star award!

Face it.  Captain Queeg is dead.  If Nachbar wins the primary, which I am certain he will, for God's sake support him, because he is certainly better than "Little Randy Ricochet", and he will clearly be a better candidate than Eric Massa.


Seems to be a drive-by (0.00 / 0)
I don't see anything else from tarantula208, and there's no information about who he is or why to trust him.

I recognize that he's not a perfect candidate, but the folks I've talked with in the district - admittedly all from Corning - liked him a lot.  (They had no such unity about Samara Barend, who ran the time before and kind of imploded.)


[ Parent ]
Oops (0.00 / 0)
Should be "I recognize that Massa's not a perfect candidate" - I don't think tarantula208 was offering to run.

[ Parent ]
Not a drive by, just a first timer on this blog (0.00 / 0)
Sorry to be harsh with Massa, but "he is not a perfect candidate" is an understatement.

And no, you have no reason to trust me.  But as a party, we are still severely in the deficit when it comes to 1) money, 2) voter confidence and 3) control of the way this country is being run, and the way the Bushies have set it up, it'll be a long time before we can fix that third one - if ever - so we really need to focus on finding and supporting "professional" candidates that will listen with their ears and not their mouths and understand that they are members of a party (hard to imagine, I know) and not Rambo. 

I am all for 'roots inspired and supported candidates - hell I supported John Hall, Jerry McNerney and, yes, even Eric Massa last time - but fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice...

And by the way, just to keep things in perspective here and over on Kos, Eric Massa was a friggin' Republican, too!  So far, those seem to be the only people in the district with the werewithal to run for Congress!

So instead of raising a stink and hurling accusations at solid public servants like Louise because Massa was not given a HUGE benefit of the doubt by the Democratic party this time around, take a serious look at the bigger picture and you'll see that maybe, just maybe (yes, with their track record, I know it's a stretch) the "insiders" might actually know what they're doing here.


[ Parent ]
Massa / Slaughter (0.00 / 0)
Let's be honest.  Slaughter has done almost nothing for her own district, let alone anywhere else in Upstate NY, in her 20 years in Congress.  She loves getting awards from Hollywood and hanging out with arts people from the Arts Caucus, but she left Upstate NY years ago and hasn't looked back.  She won't support Massa because she knows he'd get more press attention than she would, and she can't stand another Democrat getting the spotlight in her own backyard.  Look at her relationship with Bill Johnson (hint: they never spoke) or Joe Morelli (hint: they never speak).  Slaughter is isolated from the Democrat party in Monroe County (which, btw, she never gives any money to, even though she hasn't had an opponent in 10 years) and goes her own arrogant way.

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